Tuesday, 29 January 2013

Walter Veith discusses SDA Eschatology

Description of the above video clip:

Part 2 is a study of the king of the south that pushes against Catholicism at the time of the end, but it also investigates the intrigues of setting up the conditions for the final victory of the king of the north. The secret intrigues of Napoleon, the setting up of a false system of worship, and a counterfeit theology regarding the antichrist, the dispensationalist view, and the creation of the Jewish state and Zionism are all discussed. Viewers will be surprised to discover the origin of the Jews and the state of Israel. This DVD concludes the study of Daniel 11 and prepares the way for the modern fulfillment of these prophecies.


One of my gracious Twitter followers ("CassTete") passed this video clip (via this link) to me for my review. A little online searching reveals that Walter Veith is a Seventh Day Adventist (SDA). I grew up in that church in my earlier years and moved well away from it, because I did not agree with it's mainline doctrine. But, Veith makes so many truthful points in this clip, that I could not resist posting it onto my blog.

Most SDAs hold to the belief that the final "antichrist" is the Pope, and they believe it is the Vatican that secretly runs the world. From my experience and knowledge, such beliefs run contrary to what I have seen and witnessed in my own life. Rome does not run the world, global Jewry runs the world, and such a concept flies well over the heads of most SDAs. Veith does a nice job of explaining the Jewish masonic elite, the true nature of the Talmud, the "Israel of God," the issues surrounding the destruction of the Jewish Temple, and much more! This is a nice presentation.

I can't fully endorse everything that he proclaims, but I can say that many of the issues addressed in this video clip are truthful to that of my understanding. 

The video clip is 1 hour and 38 minutes, and it is well worth the time to view it! 


"CassTete" provided me with this youtube clip of Walter Veith where he discusses SDA law with his reasons for the beliefs that he holds to. Much of it appears more along the lines of mainline SDA doctrine, some, if not much of which I disagree with. If I agreed with a fair amount of Veith's points in the video clip above, then I will say the inverse of that is the case in the video clip below.

In this 1 hour video clip, one can learn much about what mainline SDA's believe. He gets into a number of issues, including the issue of the "Sabbath" and observance of days. He's heard the accusation that SDA's are viewed as legalists, and to that criticism, he prefers to say that he is a "loyalist." By that, he means that he (as an SDA) is more "loyal" to Scripture than to people like me who would refer to SDAs as liberal "legalists." To be fair, SDA's do take aspects of Scripture, and interpret it in a literalistic form. Those doing this with Old Testament (in particular) Scripture are bound to ignore historical context. In ignoring historical context, misinterpretation of Scripture is a foregone reality.

Jesus chastised the Pharisees and violated "Sabbath" observance when He would heal people and perform other miracles (on the Sabbath day)! Jesus was sick and tired of legalism among the Pharisees, and today, the same Pharisitical attitudes are among Jews and Judaizing Christians of today! 

Since Jesus' ushering in of the New Covenant, Sabbath-observance, like many other feasts & customs have been relegated to their proper place -- the types and shadows of the past (i.e., the Old Covenant before Christ). 

Veith contends that Jesus has not fully fulfilled the "Sabbath" because there is still sin in the world today! For sure, there is still sin in the world. Yet, full redemption (as referenced in Revelation 20 - 22) is not a requirement "for the people of God" (ref to Hebrews 4:9) to obtain Sabbath "rest." Yet, the "rest" that SDA's (and Judaic Jews) observe is merely the legalistic observance of days, and ceasing to do "work" (however that term may be defined). There is a spiritual aspect to this concept of "rest" and it is described in Hebrews 4:

So there remains a Sabbath rest for the people of God. 10 For the one who has entered His rest has himself also rested from his works, as God did from His. (Hebrews 4:9-10 NASB)
The Sabbath rest is more than just taking one day (Saturday) off and working all other days of the week. True Sabbath rest actually means "rest" from the sinful and wicked ways of the world everyday of the week, and month after month, and year after year. When we accept Jesus' sacrifice on for our sins, and when we live according to His Word, that my friends is the true "rest" that we get. That "rest" is what it means to "live free in Christ"... a foreign concept to MOST Christians of today! Yes, sin still exist around us (as Veith truthfully indicates), but we are at "rest" even when the world has not yet seen full redemption, which is yet future (ref: Revelation 20 - 22). 

Judaic Jews never found the "rest" that I am referring to in the previous paragraph. Most of them have been "mammon-worshipers" (i.e., worshipers of money) throughout the ages and up until today. Even if they "rest" on Saturday, many of them don't even find "true" rest on that day, because their minds are so wrapped up with their over-complicated lives, and just how they're going to ramp up the "money-changing" scams on Monday morning and the remaining days of that week! There is no "rest" in money-changing! There is no "rest" for the wicked (to express this concept more broadly)! They may make alot of money, but these people NEVER find "rest!" So to the SDA out there, the Bible advocates that you NOT emulate the Jews...i.e., do not be a "Judaizer" as the Book of Titus explicitly indicates.

Another critical verse is Colossians 2:16-17. 
16 Therefore no one is to act as your judge in regard to food or drink or in respect to a festival or a new moon or a Sabbath day— 17 things which are a mere shadow of what is to come; but the substance belongs to Christ.
(Colossians 2:16-17 NASB)
As believers in Christ, we are not to pass judgment on other "believers" for what they eat or whether (or not) they observe festivals or days (like the "Sabbath day"). 

Also, Veith may have never considered why it is that the New Testament (NT) reiterates 9 of the 10 Commandments in the Old Testament (OT). And can you guess which of the "10 Commandments" for which there is no mention of to observe in the NT? It is the issue of Sabbath observance! I have challenged several SDA preachers with this question, and none have been able to even provide an answer to my question. 

Why then is Veith implying that those who don't observe days (like the Sabbath) are still living in "Babylon?" The above verse states that the Sabbath, and Mosaic-backed legalistic dietary laws that Adventists like to impose upon themselves (and others) are shadowy aspects of the past. When SDAs behave in such a manner, they are in total violation of Colossians 2:16.

Certainly, vegetarianism has many wonderful health benefits, and I advocate it within proper limits. I don't advocate strict veganism. But, I do advocate eating fish, cheese, milk, etc. As believers in Christ, we are not to judge others by what they eat, or by whether (or not) they observe shadowy Mosaic customs of the past that were for the Jews of the day.

Indeed, Jews were wicked throughout the Old Covenant, and God (via Moses) needed to discipline them. He did so by giving Jews (not Gentiles) the "10 Commandments" to follow. Today, people are just as wicked, and so Jesus gave all of us "The Commandments." Notice that I did NOT say the "10 Commandments." The NT gives us 9 of the 10 Commandments of the OT plus a new commandment to "love one another as yourself." 
34 A new commandment I give to you, that you love one another, even as I have loved you, that you also love one another. (John 13:34 NASB)
The "remnant ones" that the SDA consider themselves to be have added to the NT, all sorts of shadowy things of the past that Jesus long since fulfilled with the blood that He shed on the Cross! Would it not seem that Jesus would take a dim view of such practices for that which He fulfilled?  

There's really not much more I need to say about "Sabbath-observance." Jesus violated the legalistic aspects of it by doing legitimate "work" on that day, and He proved that what really matters is "righteousness," not liberal "legalism!"

UPDATE - May 11, 2013:

To the readers out there, I felt a need to copy/paste a blog entry that gives a basic explanation of why Sabbath observance (or observance of days) is no longer a Biblical requirement. 

Why don't we observe the original Sabbath?

Thanks for asking!
This issue has been a sticking point between sabbatarians and the rest of the Body of Christ for some time...but it shouldn't be. The Bible is very clear on this subject. Let's forget for a moment about Constantine, or that the Sabbath was a sign between God and the Israelites of their covenant (and so completely out of date) and focus on God's purpose for the Sabbath.
Let's start in Genesis...
The word "sabbath" means "rest". This isn't the kind of rest we need after a good workout. The word literally means 'the ending of activity'. God didn't rest on the seventh day because He was tired. God had finished creating the world, and so He stopped. He didn't pick up where He left off when the weekend was over...He was done.
Let's move to Exodus...
God's covenant with the children of Israel included a lot of religious activity, including the creation of a tabernacle, sacrifices of animals, and so on. This activity only stopped on the Sabbath. Now, remember: the Sabbath isn't about being tired...it's about being finished with your work. The priests couldn't stop working the way that God did in Genesis. They took a day off and went right back to it the next day. Why? Because the work wasn't finished. They did the same things day after day, year after year. They were even forbidden to have chairs in the tabernacle because sitting down would suggest that their work was done!
Let's keep going to the New Testament...
The Exodus Sabbath was a symbol of God's rest in Genesis. It told the children of Israel that they would someday be able to stop working...to stop sacrificing for their own sins. When Jesus died and rose again, that day had finally come. In Hebrews 10:11-12 we see the comparison between the Jewish priests and Jesus:
Day after day every priest stands and performs his religious duties; again and again he offers the same sacrifices, which can never take away sins. But when this priest [Jesus] had offered for all time one sacrifice for sins, he sat down at the right hand of God.
Jesus finished His work and rested, just as we see God doing in Genesis.
What about us?
How then should we view the Sabbath? God rested when His work was done, and Jesus rested when His work was done. The ancient Jews never enjoyed that rest, but it's available to us today, as Hebrews 4:9-10 tell us:
There remains, then, a Sabbath-rest for the people of God; for anyone who enters God's rest also rests from his own work, just as God did from his.
Let's look at Colossians 2:16-17, which should erase any doubt about the nature of the Sabbath:
Therefore do not let anyone judge you by what you eat or drink, or with regard to a religious festival, a New Moon celebration or a Sabbath day. These are a shadow of the things that were to come; the reality, however, is found in Christ.
From all of these verses we can see that the Sabbath clearly isn't a day of the week. It's neither Saturday nor Sunday! We enter into the Sabbath rest when we stop working, and that only happens when we accept that Jesus' sacrifice was for each of us. His work is done, and He invites us to join Him.
Posted: Sun, Feb 10 2008 - 22:24 PM (Source link: http://godwords.org/posts.php?id=78 )

Also, for a more in-depth analysis, read a book by Dr. Jay Adams called Keeping the Sabbath Today? This book is the best I have seen on this topic. 


  1. Hi Jason , we have a issue because if you say " ... respect to a festival or a new moon or a Sabbath day ... you are not quoting the KJV where it says "days" ... which are different days as per http://www.sabbathtruth.com/faq/frequently-asked-questions/articletype/articleview/articleid/929/please-explain-colossians-214.aspx

    And I spotted this prior to reading the link i sent , i know very little to be honest with you . What I know is that all this is coded into each & everyone of us . I have faith more than Biblical knowledge , I know far more on many other subjects BUT I feel the truth .

    here is the problem , the SDA is the only keeping the 7th day .... & I KNOW .. that Sunworship is Sunday .. & moving it to Sunday , changing the calender .. removing Jesus 168 times from KJV to Jesuit speaks volumes .

    Nothing is ever as it seems , first times I heard Walter I agreed with most BUT Napolean .... French Revolution a Vatican move ?!? I couldn't but again ... Egalite , Liberte , Fraternite ... the Hat .... the statue of Liberty ( Sun bearer ) . The butchering of the Orthodox , by Turks (created by Vatican a.p.Walter) by the Croats( 800 000 butchered Serbs yet one doesn't stop talking about 6000 "pieces" of Bosnian s , + 5 000 000 Orthodox by the Russian communists ... 800 000 Greeks by the Germans ... only few thousand Jews ! The fake Holocaust as Walter shows was just about recruiting the Khazars Talmud followers ( perversion of Torah taught to Rabies in Israel)

    In the bigger picture it is the King of the North ( they are a.p. Walter also Families of the house of Solomon )

    He may be wrong here and there , without being able to point out specifics besides that Pyramids & Symbols are also free energy / energising devices BUT that is another science he is unfamiliar with. The Pagans keep these secrets to themselves to control the world , BUT GOD has no secrets hence it is not that they r bad symbols they just use by the bad guys !
    God bless & glad to chat to you and to have a knowledgeable online buddy ; )

  2. Thanks for posting your comment yannis (aka "CassTete" on Twitter)!

    The NASB & KJV are both legit versions. The reformists prefer the NASB, due to the fact that the KJV 1611 is grossly misinterpreted by many Christians. The older the version a Bible is, the greater the disagreement among those who study it! The two top versions for the Christians of today are either the NASB or the HCSB. Jesus is the "Sabbath" which He fulfilled and those who believe accept His sacrifice NOW have the "rest" that His Kingdom (not of this world) offers.

    The most critical point that I make is this: God did not create us to be a bunch of legalistic robots! In the Old Covenant, God instituted Mosaic Law, because the Jews were sooo very corrupt...probably worse than they are in today's world! The same can also be said of the Gentiles then versus today!

    God used Mosaic law as a tool to instituted discipline among the Jews - his chosen bloodline of the day. With Jesus, we now have a NT. Where in the NT is there any mandate to observe the Sabbath?

    If you can answer just that basic question, then you will have accomplished something that no other SDA has been able to!

  3. the 10 commandents(gods moral law,the law of the universe)was given at creation before there was ever such thing as a jew or a gentile,how then do you claim the 10 commandments were given to the jews only???,the jews had many "sabbaths"and "festivals"the cerimonial laws and customs are what were done away with not the 10 commandments which are universal and eternal,christ was and is the ultimate sacrifice,the only commandent that says to "remember"is the sabbath commandment because god knew it would be forgotton,agrue what you will,we shall all see on that great and mighty day of the lord shall we not

  4. @ TonyP: Thanks for your response to my blog entry. Just to clarify, "The 10 Commandments" were given at the time of Moses, which did not occur when God created the world as cited in Genesis. Refer to Exodus 19:8. The Jews had serious trouble following God's word, and at that time, Jews indeed were God's chosen and favored people who were to serve as a "light" to the Gentiles (Goyim). That did NOT happen then and it is NOT happening today.

    We are now living in the New Covenant, which is "the times of the Gentiles."

    Feel free to check out some of my other blog entries tagged with either "Zionism" or "Eschatology." My published book also sheds light on eschatological issues, which so many Christians have misunderstood for the last 2000 years.

  5. @ Jason: Genesis 26:5 says that Abraham also kept the commandments before Moses, and Ex 16:28 also predates mount Sinai. God created the Sabbath at creation, and Revelation 14:12 talks about his remnant keeping his commandments still. God blessed and sanctified the Sabbath on the seventh day of creation week. All the disciples also kept it.....

    Peter said that Noah was "a preacher of righteousness" (2 Peter 2:5). But... what is righteousness?

    Psalms 119:172
    My tongue shall speak of thy word: for all thy commandments are righteousness.

    Righteousness is the "commandments," which includes, of course, the Sabbath (Exodus 20:8-11)

    Adam to Noah had a clear understanding of sin, and sin is defined as the transgression of the law.

    please read;


  6. Here is a complete detailed history of the Sabbath


  7. @Johannes:

    Thanks for reading my blog and replying to this blog entry! I have to assume many are SDA readers. It is my belief that many SDA intend to follow Scripture to the T and that is my intent as well. The problem is that SDA people

    It is true that Abraham followed God's "Commandments" even before the "10 Commandments" were given to Moses long before the "10 Commandments" were written by God's hand on the stone tablets. But, where does it say in the Old Testament that Abraham kept the Sabbath?

    Read this:

    The answer is that Abraham did not observe the "Sabbath" (or Saturday) worship, and neither did Adam or Noah!

    The take away is this: There are differences between the "Commandments" and the "10 Commandments" (given to Jews only). Jews were under Mosaic Law, the gentiles were not.

    I recommend Dr. Jay Adams book. Scroll to the last portion of my blog entry.

  8. Above, I left one comment unfinished. I meant to say at the end of the first paragraph, that many SDA people look at the details of Scripture, but that they fail to see the bigger picture of it, and therefore loose the wider context of what the Scriptures truly mean.

  9. Your comment above basically says that no one(Abraham, Adam & Noah) kept the Sabbath but God Himself at creation kept the Sabbath as seen in Genesis 2:2-3 when God RESTED on the SEVENTH day from all His work and BLESSED the SEVENTH day and MADE IT HOLY. The 4th commandment refers to the same weekly Sabbath by saying "REMEMBER the Sabbath day, to KEEP it HOLY..but the SEVENTH day IS the SABBATH of the Lord...for in six days the Lord made the heavens ..and RESTED the SEVENTH day. Therefore the Lord BLESSED the Sabbath day and MADE IT HOLY."

    God in his LOVE made our first parents on the sixth day so that He could spend time with them on the seventh day or Sabbath which was really the first full day of their life so it is obvious that Adam and Eve did keep it too. Jesus said "If you love Me, you will keep My commandments" John 14:15. We love Him because He first loved us. "For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life. Eccl. 12:13 says "Fear God, and keep His commandments; for this is the whole duty of man".

    The 4th commandment refers to the same Sabbath God created and kept Holy at creation. God is the same yesterday, today, and forever (Hebrew 13:8)and therefore doesn't change. He even had the Jews keep the Sabbath day before He even gave Moses the 10 Commandments on stone tablets. See Exodus 16:4 where God says He wanted to test the children of Israel whether they will walk in "My LAW" or not by raining manna for six days but not on the seventh. Verses 22-30 explain why they weren't supposed to gather on the seventh day because it was the Sabbath and in verse 28 God even asks how long do they refuse to keep "My COMMANDMENTS and My LAWS". His law of love is not limited to stone tablets but has always existed because God is the Alpha and Omega and the I AM. God's commandments are an expression of His character and His love. In John 15:10 Jesus said "If you keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in His love." In Matt. 5:18-19 He says "For assuredly, I say to you, Till heaven and earth pass away, one jot or one tittle will by no means pass from the law till all is fulfilled. Whoever therefore breaks one of the least of these commandments, and teaches men so, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but whoever does and teaches them, he shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven." Not only does God's Law not change, even punctuation marks remain.

    The creation Sabbath continued in Adam's life and in his children's because Adam & Methuselah's lives overlapped 243 years, and Methuselah & Shem (Noah's son) 100 yrs., and Shem & Abraham 150 yrs. There was no chance that the creation Sabbath was forgotten, not taught, or not known before the children of Israel were reminded about it after 400 years of slavery when God wrote the commandments on stone.

    GOD IS LOVE AND GOD LOVES YOU! I thank God for His law of love!

  10. @ feq

    Thanks for your comments to this blog entry.

    To your point in made in John 15, you quoted the following: "Jesus said "If you love Me, you will keep My commandments" John 14:15."

    In ALL NT verses, Jesus never utters the word "TEN Commandments." What He does say repeatedly is "My Commandments." There is difference between the two. I.e., that which was given to the Jews via Moses about 4000 years ago, and that which Jesus stated during His Ministry on Earth.

    My suggestion to you and to all who believe we must live under Mosaic Law (which was NOT abolished, but FULFILLED by Jesus Christ), is to read Dr. Jay Adams book referenced above, or to read my book for more details.